Hey Stu!
So I think your name isn’t Stuart, but Stuyvesant? That’s pretty neat. My apologies for the error.
Thanks for replying to my thing I did and stuff. I suppose I’ll reply anew, and we can keep going at it forever. Remind me: did you want to start a podcast or no? I’m not joking.
I’ll try to keep my replyreply short. Besides, Nick Heer made the obvious retorts better than I would’ve anyway.
I especially like this bit:
Nick quoting you and then replying (link added by me):
Gruber never just objectively reports on something. He even linked to that list of spoiled brats as if there was a lesson to be learned from it. Most people saw that said, “Jesus, what vapid horrible little shits!” but Gruber managed to look at it and say, “Apple’s really nailed consumer demand and brand awareness!”
So?
Exactly. Here’s the thing, Stu: I want you to read things closer and allow for nuanced perspectives.
More than one thing can be true, Stu, even at the same time. And, yeah, lessons can be learned from that. That’s why Gruber is worth reading. Instead of having the shallow reaction that most people have, he skimmed a little insight off the top. Nice! Well done, Gruber! He didn’t condemn them as vapid horrible little shits because that’s what everyone else was already saying, and it was kind of obvious.
Anyway, “So?” is a more succinct reply, but that was my thought on that.
You, Stu:
But, anyway, Max still manages to miss several of my points in weird ways.
Maybe! I’m excited and interested to look at those. I’m pretty sure I just disagreed with your points, though.
My attack is not on capitalism, and it’s not even on selfishness, it’s on selling ignorance. It’s especially on selling ignorance by creating a polarizing moral/personal conflict where normal people shouldn’t even see one. Apple vs Google/Microsoft definitely falls into this category.
This is super interesting to me in large part because I have no idea what you’re talking about and I mostly think it’s all in your head. I desperately want you to cogently unpack this feeling you have in a way that makes you sound un-paranoid because maybe you’re right, but so far you sound kind of like I did a few years ago when I was really annoyed with the music site Pitchfork because they wouldn’t cover the bands I liked and I really wanted them to and eventually got over it.
Name the Android/Google equivalent of John Gruber. I’d like to write about him, too.
I don’t know. I know I’d love to read her though.
Me, then you:
When we’re talking about what will succeed with the mass market, that’s where normal people come in. But if we’re talking about what’s best? I don’t know. Normal people are fine, I guess, but I’ll stick with the nerds.
Well then you probably should be using Android. Normal people are picking Android, and I’d wager that the vast majority of nerds pick Android as well, and strangely for the same reasons probably: openness, choice—things Apple will never be good at because they will never try to be.
Maybe. But nerds come in all flavors, thank goodness. I’m the type of nerd who came very close to getting an Android phone (some old tweets as evidence fwiw: one, two) but ultimately chose the iPhone, for nerdy reasons.
Finally, I guess I should reply to this bit:
Me, then you:
Is he saying that Android is doomed because Windows Mobile failed? No! He’s saying that Windows Mobile failed, and now Android is doing the same thing.
Yes, and John Gruber is clearly pointing out this connection for no reason at all, and definitely not because he thinks it’s the reason Android is doomed. The above series of three sentences is probably the stupidest thing I have read. “He’s saying this and implying nothing by saying it, I swear!”
That’s the stupidest thing you’ve read? What, ever?
Score!
I sincerely urge you to consider reading things closer and with more nuance.
Gosh, I don’t want to explain myself word by word, but this seems pretty clear cut to me.
Me:
Is he saying that Android is doomed because Windows Mobile failed? No! He’s saying that Windows Mobile failed, and now Android is doing the same thing.
You:
Yes, and John Gruber is clearly pointing out this connection for no reason at all, and definitely not because he thinks it’s the reason Android is doomed.
What?
Where did I say (or even suggest) that Gruber is pointing out this connection for no reason at all? I didn’t. Not even a little.
He’s basically saying, isn’t it interesting that Android is taking the same strategy that a failed thing took?
You can react to that however you want.
My reaction: hmm, yeah, interesting. I wonder if maybe they’ll change course or somehow else avoid that fate.
Your reaction: DOOM
I ask again: Do you disagree with the article? Did you even read it? Yeah, Gruber shared a thing that suggests Android is employing bad strategy, but it was you who elevated it to sensationalism by putting words in his mouth that he thinks the company is “doomed”, and specifically for those reasons. Your inferences aren’t his opinions, and criticizing them as such is a classic straw man.
I’d love to read someone with thoughtful, nuanced, well-reasoned criticisms of Gruber or Apple borne of close readings and measured thoughts. And sometimes you do it, Stu, but that wasn’t an example of it, and calling me stupid wasn’t either.
A Max Jacobson joint
